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Banned for Botting/automation
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Post by
Realdur
Hi, i got banned for what they tell me is using bots and/or automation programs.
now i'm not into that stuff and barely even use add-ons, but what i do like to do is farm.
this week the Right binding dropped from Garr in Molten core for me, after having the left one from Geddon for a long time already.
so i finally figure out how the quest to get Thunderfury starts and it tells me i need 10 Enchanted elementium bars which each require 10 Arcanite bars and some other stuff, for that i needed 100 Arcane crystals.
so anyway, long story short a friend gave me 20 arcanite bars cause he had the mats in his bank, and i gave him 80 Arcane crystals and 80 Thorium bars which took me most of the day to farm
i turned in the quest, kill Thunderaan, turn in quest and get Thunderfury, guild gets achieve for it and next day i'm banned..
i open an appeals which they said would take from 24 hours to 2 days to answer which in my opinion took too long, so i started a live webchat with Shipensa, who was nice enough to look into it and answer the ticket.
Gave me an answer saying the Penalty is a 72 hour ban for the same reason they initially banned me for, better then a permanent ban but still, i did not do anything wrong and should not get this punishment at all.
is there anything that can be done to fix this? the customer service representative looked into it for 2 seconds and answered it with this automated answer not caring what my story was.
Vynloth - Archimonde (owner of the Thunderfury)
Armaximor - Archimonde (char that did the farming of Thorium and smelting the Enchanted elementium)
Post by
SoCalWoWGal
and next day i'm banned..
Bans do not happen that fast, investigations take place and then the account is
usually
given a warning before it is banned. Blizzard has a penalty volcano, as explained in
Warnings, Suspensions, and Closures
. The fact that you were "Banned" means that you did something that was deemed by Blizzard to merit the highest level of penalty.
i open an appeals which they said would take from 24 hours to 2 days to answer which in my opinion took too long For Blizzard to investigate the account it can take time as well as the fact that there are other appeals that their customer service team is investigating so the time frame is really quite reasonable. There are times of the year when the ticket wait time is much higher due to increased volume, considering that Blizzard services close to 8 million accounts, a 2 day wait time for an investigation to be made on such a serious matter is really not unreasonable.
i did not do anything wrong and should not get this punishment at all.
Read the
ToU
and
EULA
There you will find this statement by Blizzard:
Blizzard may terminate this Agreement (and your access to the Game) with or without notice for any reason, or for no reason.
Blizzard took action based on what they observed in game and then you appealed their action and they had another person look at your account and the decision was made to reduce the severity of your punishment.
is there anything that can be done to fix this? the customer service representative looked into it for 2 seconds and answered it with this automated answer not caring what my story was.
There is nothing to "fix", you broke the rules and Blizzard gave you a second chance to allow you to continue to play. You now need to read the
ToU
and
EULA
and steer clear of breaking the rules in the future.
Post by
Realdur
so according to you i'm breaking the rules by playing fairly?
and the person looking at my account reviewed it in under 20 seconds and answered the ticket, in which time it's highly doubtfull to check someones account for whatever kind of evidence that i was using a bot or not.
anyway if it was not caused by farming the mats for Thunderfury idk what caused it, i have 3 add-ons which are Atlasloot, Recount and a bag add-on for easy overview of bags, thats it. no automated programs and/or bots
Post by
Araxom
Hi Realdur, If you see this before I'm out for the evening (4:30PM PST) please post your most recent ticket ID# and I'll be happy to provide you an update about the ticket status.
On a side note, although it may be tangential in this case, we recommend that folks use the
authenticator
and
SMS Protect
to help make sure that accounts are protected as well as can be. Thanks for your patience while we address this!
P.S. If you post after I leave tonight, you're also welcome to see about setting up a call back with us through the following
support portal
. Although our lines are currently full, we'll likely see a decrease in volume as it gets later in the evening.
Post by
Realdur
the most recent is Ticket US42047767
this was after my chat with another Customer support representative who assumed i did break the rules and gave me the 72 hour ban + labeled me as a cheater.
I appreciate your help and apologize in advance if I opened up too many tickets. I hope you understand how frustrating this is after all the time I spend on leveling several toons, professions, grind gear/rep/pets/mounts and several Legendary weapons.
And thank you for the tip, while I do have a physical authenticator i'll look into getting the mobile version aswell.
Post by
Araxom
Thank you, my pleasure to try and help! I'll be back in a bit :)
Update:
Okay, I've reviewed the notes - we stand by the information that we have on the account. With that said, as this was the first penalty of its kind on the account, we previously overturned the action to a 72 hour temporary suspension.
Although I will not go into the specifics about what led us to take this action, please know that I have personally reviewed the information and that I've found this suspension was in accordance with the account activity I see there. Please know that we do not want to take our players out of the game without reason nor do we want to cause undo inconvenience, however we do stand by the integrity of the game and reserve the right to take action on an account when we believe that the Terms of Use were knowingly violated.
Thank you for your understanding.
Regards,
Araxom
Blizzard Customer Support
Post by
Realdur
So in the future i should be scared and careful while playing?
I find it odd that honest players get banned and limited in their gameplay cause this method of detecting bots is sweeping up players who play normally.
This goes against everything you said about not wanting to take players out of the game without reason, and not wanting to cause inconvenience, integrity goes down the drain too when you start accusing/banning innocent players..
If i can't play honestly without bots/automation i see no reason to play at all as this method is clearly flawed and does not guarantee this won't happen again. leading me to waste my time and money until someone mistakes me for a bot again.
I'll rethink my wife and my own subscription, although i do enjoy WoW it's a shame customers get treated like crap.
Very disapointed you can't differentiate between bots and players who farm legally.
Post by
Araxom
I wanted to make sure that this was addressed, and that I had a clear understanding of what transpired. Thank you for giving me a chance to investigate the issue on your behalf. Please know that although I will be unable to modify the suspension, you will again have access after the 72 hours suspension is over.
Post by
Woodrun
as this was the first penalty of its kind on the account, we previously overturned the action to a 72 hour temporary suspension.
Be glad you weren't perma-banned.
Post by
Realdur
Untill when? untill next time they decide I am using bots or automated programs while i am just playing on my own farming stuff myself? and at that point they go back in records saying it's the 2nd time and might not give a 2nd chance.
Is it worth it spending tons of time and money this way when you are unsure of wether or not this bugged system will or will not flag you?
The part you quoted speaks for itself, It's the first. and they can't even say with 100% certainty that i did use bots, but next time they'll say it's the 2nd time without being sure of it.
Post by
SoCalWoWGal
so according to you i'm breaking the rules by playing fairly?
Obviously some activity on your account caused the "warning buzzer" to go off at Blizzard and your account was suspended. And yes, sometimes it can "appear" that you are breaking the rules when you are "playing fairly". Based on the information that you have provided, in your case, it
may
have appeared that there were transactions that broke the rules under
8.Ownership/Selling of the Account or Virtual Items
Blizzard does not recognize any purported transfers of virtual property executed outside of the Game, or the purported sale, gift or trade in the “real world” of anything that appears or originates in the Game. Accordingly, you may not sell in-game items or currency for “real” money, or exchange those items or currency for value outside of the Game.
Think about how the transactions that occurred between you and your friend look to an independent outside third party, who can only see what transpired in game and not in any other medium other that the game world.
So in the future i should be scared and careful while playing?
What you need to do is make sure that you are familiar with the rules and regulations that are applicable to this game (as well as any other game that you choose to play) and understand
how your actions
can be interpreted by those who created the game. You are responsible for knowing the rules and adhering to them.
Post by
Realdur
SoCal, i traded him 80 Arcane crystals and 80 Thorium bars. he transmuted 80 Arcanite bars and gave them to me. is it wrong for a guildie to transmute something i provided the mats for?
and the 20 Arcanite bars he gave me before i paid him for with gold ingame.
as they can see transactions in-game they can see this was all done fairly.
I understand you are trying to help, but pulling reasons why they banned me out of a hat is not helping. You do not know what went on. And again, i know the rules and adhere to them.. which is the point of this topic. to undo this ban on an honest player. They can see what went on in-game and if they really look into it they will see nothing wrong with my playstyle.
I rarely use AH so it's not like i'm a bot farming gold to sell, I leveled several toons and try to get up several professions to be able to make everything myself.
The only thing that could have set this off is just manually farming everything, in the case of farming Thorium i did keep 80 Thorium in my bags and deleted every excess thorium and dense stones i got after every node i hit.
Now what you need to do is please refrain from replying, as i'm sure you can come up with 100 reasons why i am banned since you have no clue what went on. Saying i need to follow the rules while i did and still got banned does not help either.
Post by
Woodrun
A.
the 20 Arcanite bars he gave me before i paid him for with gold ingame
B.
deleted every excess thorium and dense stones i got after every node i hit
.
A. If he was a guildie and you provided all the mats, why would you pay him gold? Can look like gold transfers for RMT.
B. That can look like botting.
Now what you need to do is please refrain from replying, as i'm sure you can come up with 100 reasons why i am banned
since you have no clue what went on
. Saying i need to follow the rules while i did and still got banned does not help either
You are not the first person to post "Why did I get Banned?" on Wowhead.
Posters respond to posts, and
SoCal
responded based on the info you provided.
Blizzard is the source of your issue, not posters here on Wowhead.
Post by
Realdur
The reason i paid him gold was because i provided him mats for 80 Arcanite bars, i needed a total of 100 and he already had mats himself for 20. so i just paid him for the 20 bars he used his own mats for.
Instead of bothering honest players, why don't they simply join AV or Isle of conquest to catch bots lol
Post by
lonewolfe31705
Realdur, I don't know if you broke ToS or EuLa, and could honestly care less. (Which is how the majority of people reading your QQ thread feel.) Socal and Woodrun have both given you their honest opinion about what could have flagged your account with suspicious activities.
There have been numerous threads about this and they all end up 1 of 2 ways...the person finally admits they did something wrong, or the thread gets locked because it turns into a flame war because the OP continues to say "I've never broken ToS or EULA." Which we all do in one form or fashion on a daily basis.
. deleted every excess thorium and dense stones i got after every node i hit.
That looks like botted activity...
Honestly, I could care less how many "honest players" Blizz "wrongfully" bans because only 2 out of 10 are probably good honest players.
Post by
Realdur
just because it looks botted doesn't mean it is botted.
btw, aren't there any files i can send or some sort of proof that i didnt do it?
Post by
Wowpixel
Realdur, I don't know if you broke ToS or EuLa, and could honestly care less. (Which is how the majority of people reading your QQ thread feel.) Socal and Woodrun have both given you their honest opinion about what could have flagged your account with suspicious activities.
There have been numerous threads about this and they all end up 1 of 2 ways...the person finally admits they did something wrong, or the thread gets locked because it turns into a flame war because the OP continues to say "I've never broken ToS or EULA." Which we all do in one form or fashion on a daily basis.
. deleted every excess thorium and dense stones i got after every node i hit.
That looks like botted activity...
Honestly, I could care less how many "honest players" Blizz "wrongfully" bans because only 2 out of 10 are probably good honest players.
Well, I will say this thread is very informative (and probably for countless others who have the same problem of being falsely flagged as being a bot, and found this very thread on a Google search).
My sis currently is tangled up with the latest bot ban, which first began with an accusation of being a bot. The thing is she wouldn't even understand what a bot is, let alone how to configure it to use. As the "investigation" continued they couldn't find any evidence of botting itself, but focused on the ore she dumped in the AH as "economy" breaking (looking for something to "stick"). Again, something a player new to gaming wouldn't know is a violation or a problem, when she sees others doing the same.
There's a serious problem with the bot script Blizzard is using to identify true bots, and in the process any excessive activity is being flagged. My sis is a completist and is trying to obtain Titanium to prospect for Titanium powder for more Dalaran Jewelcrafting tokens, so yes she will have too much ore and nowhere to dump it but the AH (vendoring it would even be a waste of time. WoW doesn't have what EQ2 has like a guild harvest depot to drop mats into, either). So Blizzard's bot catcher caught someone who is mining a lot of Saronite ore, but not the purpose for that mining -- for Titanium ore -- yet the review team isn't seeing the cause and effect (like reviewing account history to see the purpose of the activity -- buying Titanium ore, mining for Titanium ore then prospecting it for powders for tokens. All legit game activity).
The OP is in the same position my sister is in -- buying needed goods to complete something; too much ore/byproducts if you mine it itself, and problems in dumping it all. My sis also had the problem in not understanding that dumping ore on the AH wasn't kosher (as it's not something that is taught ingame).
All this is a classic example of over reaching. Although the purpose (banning bots) is good, truly innocent people get flagged also if their completists. Even if it's 1 in 10 players, it's still too many as unlike other MMOs WoW costs money not only to buy the entire 5 games, subs, too.
The Q&A is missing out of the fact checking (e.g., what the player is seeking; what he's buying/selling; and what for). Behavior analysis in itself isn't enough, nor blindly following policies that doesn't educate but after the fact. WoW is extremely problematic in teaching players the dos and don'ts, as if the game is only expected to be played by online gaming veterans. The end result is they ban players so wantonly now, that players may feel it's no longer "safe" to play WoW anymore. "I, Accuse" is a double edged sword, the truly innocent will only tolerate so much protection at the price of their gaming enjoyment, too. The duping sweep last spring that tagged my herbalist family member, and now another family member who's a miner in another sweep, is too rich. None use bots, but it's just being a harvester that flags them. If my sis is banned permanently this time, 5 other family long standing accounts will also close, as this isn't a healthy gaming environment for an entire family play in (and w-a-y too expensive anyway to learn of account damaging "behaviors" only later).
Post by
Woodrun
My sis currently is tangled up with the latest bot ban, which first began with an accusation of being a bot. The thing is she wouldn't even understand what a bot is, let alone how to configure it to use. As the "investigation" continued they couldn't find any evidence of botting itself, but focused on the ore she dumped in the AH as "economy" breaking (looking for something to "stick"). Again, something a player new to gaming wouldn't know is a violation or a problem, when she sees others doing the same.
Not to flog the proverbial horse, it's the same old story. I wasn't botting, my sister wasn't botting, it was my cousin not me etc etc etc.
There's a serious problem with the bot script Blizzard is using to identify true bots
Source?
All this is a classic example of over reaching. Although the purpose (banning bots) is good, truly innocent people get flagged also if their completists.
Ridiculous, I spent hours cirlcing Zul'Drak on my DK for ore. Same in Uldaman on my Pally Tank, I got dizzy running that river back and forth.
WoW is extremely problematic in teaching players the dos and don'ts, as if the game is only expected to be played by online gaming veterans.
Players are spoon-fed the game now, my 8 year old can play it.
The end result is they ban players so wantonly now, that players may feel it's no longer "safe" to play WoW anymore. The duping sweep last spring that tagged my herbalist family member, and now another family member who's a miner in another sweep, is too rich.
Do you all play in the same house?
Post by
Wowpixel
There's a serious problem with the bot script Blizzard is using to identify true bots
Source?
When it flags a player farming for Titanium ore; shows the sheer amount of Saronite ore needed to respawn the nodes; the problem of dumping that Saronite ore and byproducts due to it; and not fact checking upon review the
intent
of the player for doing it all in the first place -- it's a serious problem.
It
will
cause false positives.
Ridiculous, I spent hours cirlcing Zul'Drak on my DK for ore. Same in Uldaman on my Pally Tank, I got dizzy running that river back and forth.
Have you tried to farm for Titanium ore for Dalaran Jewelcrafting tokens now (not in WotLK when the nodes were more abundant)? If you did, you'd understand the problem...it's not farming for ore for a couple of hours. It's a lot of farming, for weeks on in.
10 Titanium powders = 1 token (gem cuts take more than 1 token, too). At the best prospecting rate of 50%, that's 2 powders per 20 stack of Titanium. Titanium is a rare ore spawn (like Khorium), and it takes a lot of farming of Saronite to respawn a Titanium node.
Sis isn't doing this to sell ore, she's doing it for the Titanium powder to get the WotLK gem recipes. If she's not buying available Titanium ore off the AH to prospect, she's farming it.
This is why I'm saying the intent isn't being reviewed, the behavior is and rulings are coming down almost entirely upon it...
not the intent
(which could be verified...IF...Blizzard even has such data available ).
The OP was in the exact same situation my sis is in -- farming to gain the mats for a legendary weapon; my sis, Titanium powder for tokens, and each having the problem of excessive ore/byproducts to deal with, and it being the trigger if it's placed on the AH or maybe vendored. The bot catching script is identifying "bot like behavior", but not the genuine problem of too much ore and needing to dispose of it, nor the intent in mining that much. And since now two ban waves are showing the intent isn't being reviewed, I'm questioning if Blizzard even has that data to judge players so indiscriminately (as it's quite clear the only reason my sis is even farming that much IS for Titanium ore, not to sell abundant ore that anyone can trip over as it is).
It's now a Catch-22 situation for harvesters, especially miners in search of completing goals and/or achieves.
It's a "chilling effect" that it's not if, but when, a player will be flagged with data that's not really as complete as folks are claiming (e.g., Blizzard thoroughly checks all the data. Like they checked thoroughly the DPS of healers out of instances for 8 years? Yeah, something is missing in the Q&A fact checking, seriously).
Post by
Shadoed
It's now a Catch-22 situation for harvesters, especially miners in search of completing goals and/or achieves.
It's a "chilling effect" that it's not if, but when, a player will be flagged with data that's not really as complete as folks are claiming (e.g., Blizzard thoroughly checks all the data. Like they checked thoroughly the DPS of healers out of instances for 8 years? Yeah, something is missing in the Q&A fact checking, seriously).
I know we have been over this ground a thousand times already but here we go again.
I feel no problems at all with harvesting anything i need to harvest for whatever i need at any given time, i have done it over and over again and my oldest son spent days farming mining nodes for engineering and sold literally hundreds of stacks of items and neither of us have seen a whiff of a warning let alone a ban.
You say that the op is in the same boat as your sister, but you do not know that for a fact and it is backed up on here by the fact that Blizzard have personally checked his account again and stand by their suspension.
It is one thing to claim that Blizzard don't have the information, but you do not know for sure what information they do and do not have and anyone using newer and newer bots will get away with it for a time, but eventually they will be detected and added to the plethora of other bots that people thought they were getting away with for a while until caught. Of course Blizzard aren't going to hand out a list of data they do and do not have because that would lead to open season for botters which would be crazy.
You would be amazed how much information you can gather in someones actions within a piece of software, from experience i know this as i have been working on a bespoke piece of software for a finance supplier for the last three years that allows the users to take payments in the field from customers and update accounts remotely and i can see literally everything that those users are doing second by second, keypresses, when the hardware is awake or asleep, when they sync data, when the restart their application, and even down to where they are at the time they are performing these actions. It still never ceases to amaze me how many will still try and claim they have never done something when i have the evidence right in front of me, that is unfortunately human nature.
Now, as i have said before in other threads, i am not saying that you are lying about this, i have no proof of that to say so, but as i have no evidence to prove the truth either or any clue who you are i have to rely on past experience and that says that there was something being done that should not have been done and that is why bans were handed out.
I offer the same advice to everyone that asks (and even those that don't in this case) and that is, if you are using an add on or other piece of software that in any way gives you an advantage in the game over other players, then chances are you should not be using it.
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